What’s your best Roman meme?

Johntindall wrote:https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRXZu_dC3GPDKPoBkA64KSybSXITR7epdw36MxU4QMq8mTuECEQDOrxjzs&s=10

Surely a bit old fashioned for our game.........with our beloved Emperor Nero and the hugely respected, fair and honourable generals he has appointed to lead them the modern Legion's would never stage a mutiney or do anything which would require this type of punishment.

Johntindall wrote:https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRXZu_dC3GPDKPoBkA64KSybSXITR7epdw36MxU4QMq8mTuECEQDOrxjzs&s=10

Don’t be coming round here again with your sticks!

Any suggestions as to how to control more than one legion in attack or defence? How to set an efficient set of orders for them to follow??

Regor wrote:Any suggestions as to how to control more than one legion in attack or defence? How to set an efficient set of orders for them to follow??

Fairly sure that is what Centurions are for.

Your job is to ride up and down behind the lines shouting inspiration and taking note of who is fighting well and who is running away so rewards and punishment is dished out correctly. And if things start to go really wrong you and your staff are surposed to get off your horses and shore up the line. Even if you are fat, balding and sixty the Legions really do not like to lose and Senator as it causes masses of really annoying paper work.

The Roman Army at this time does not go in for want to be Alexanders. But the following rules should probably be followed:

- Do not lead you Legion into a flat desert when fighting a Cavalry Army including loads of horse archers.

- Avoid sending Columns of March loaded down with civilians and baggage through thick forest or up mountain defiles .

- Make sure your scouts can be trusted - Doubt if any Jew, Arab, Scot or German NPC can be trusted and I would not trust the players either.

- If faced with superior numbers of men painted blue and chucking rocks at your head it is normally recommended to deploy using a river or fortified camp to stop them trying to outflank you and use your Aluxilia to soak up the initial attacks before risking the lives of citizens.

And remember what you want is a good solid and bloody victory such as any semi able Roman Senator could have won. Since its really bad for your health and future prospects if Rome starts to think you are too bright by half and may be getting idea's such as is purple your colour?

Latest Newspaper for Rome is Burning has shown up - and its official - we are BANKRUPT!

Not sure what the Empires total tax income less fixed costs like the Legions and Nero gold hub caps on his chariot are but the cost to rebuild Rome's lost houses and commercial property (so no public buildings like the Golden House Palace, Temples etc) will be
892,000,000 denerii spread over ten years at 89,200,000 per year and needing 44,600 builders for that time. Costs can be reduced some if slaves used to replace some of the builders. But use too many slaves and the Roman mob lead by the builders guild will probably riot!

Think I am going right off being a man in a bed sheet......my head hurts and the maths just do not add up.

Looks like its down to the Generals 600,000,000 denerii in loot and say 20,000 slaves who can carry a hod should just about save the Senate from being lynched so no pressure lads! But why exactly are you buying wine presses from the Dacian's who have just plundered a Roman Province and claiming to be a God in the East?

Well, how do you know what’s in the Emperor’s treasury? I can’t comment on the wine press - not my plan.
But as I discover what the locals think of us Romans... it’s a lot easier than plotting what the Emperor is up to!

Regor wrote:Well, how do you know what’s in the Emperor’s treasury? I can’t comment on the wine press - not my plan.
But as I discover what the locals think of us Romans... it’s a lot easier than plotting what the Emperor is up to!

Well the Roman Treasury is not a box under Nero's bed......its the Temple of Saturn a rather large public building on top of one of the seven hills with hundreds of rather worried employee's and civil servents. Naturally as a senior magistrate of Rome by character listens to the worry and concern of lesser servant's of the Emperor. Its just a pity he is unable to do much to help them!

Treasury did get 1,250,000 from my character this month. Intent was 1,000,000 direct to the builders guild for housing works and 250,000 for treasury along with 5 recommendations to the Censor (Nero) for social improvement for clients of mine (at 50,000 dinarii donation a pop). Only got 2 out of five passed and the Treasury grapped the whole lot as a contribution towards the refurbishment costs of the Circus Maximus. Now not everyone would agree that a sport venue takes priority of flats for the plebs, but as a loyal backer of the blue's my character thinks its money well spent.

Is it only me or do we seem to be suffering inflation......rebuild costs x8 my rough estimate and x3 time. Now cost to become a senator has gone up by about x12.

My character a bit more upset that the Legions instead of beating up foreigners for the loot and hod carrying slaves urgently needed in Rome seem to be more interested in spending the tax payers money on fancy bath houses, wine presses, bonus payments for the army, beef dinners (even though true Romans did not like beef) and 40 foot high statues in marble! How much is this all costing the honest Roman tax payer !! (think I could get into this crusty old senator rolel).

Other grouch this month was with with the lack of Prudentia - the maintenance of personal discretion. Shown my one particular senator with strong links to the Egpytian grain trade! Just because the Emperor is shouting at you do not dump other people and esp women who just happen to share one of the most common female names in Rome with the Emperors mother (you know it upsets him).

Baffled by amongst the dozen or so Lady Agrippina's in Roman society the guard picked on my girl who had said sod all to said senator.

Also why public crucifixion? Which is what happens to slaves not citizens and is a public dishonour of the Aulii inlaws!! What is wrong with the traditional order to go home and committ sucide?!!! Think either its poetic justice for another bunch of Aulii informing on someone else to the Emperor. Or agema is starting to push the buttons marked feud and vendetta.

Currently seems to be a lot more dangerous to be in Rome than on duty with the Legions! The only good news is the Great general Cordula is being sent to Britain to put a size 16 hob nailed boot into the Druids and get the local legions out of the blasted bath house.

I suspect that the Legions and their commanders are watching and waiting. However if the troops don't get paid...... For now the increasingly weird behaviour of the Emperor (crucifixion of high ranking women,) is damaging the mighty in Rome but until someone decides that the cull of their mates in Rome has gone far enough I guess that observation is a good gambit?

And its because of the above that I believe that military commanders are prepared to get friendly with the barbarians. Because you don't want to be looking both ways at once and a tame barbarian is better than a mad emperor - or so I have been told!

Note also that tribes within and without the Empire are not frightened of the Legions, or of Rome's ability to provide support. Such a perceived weakness means trouble.

So I have a feeling that there will be tensions without and within the provinces growing at the same time as a disaster looms in Rome.

One might argue that a strong military minded Emperor who would justly extend the rule of Rome would be welcome. Just don't look at me, I heard Sen Brutus say it.....

And interestingly Senator Brutus has gone missing. Any ideas what might of happened?

Regor wrote:I suspect that the Legions and their commanders are watching and waiting. However if the troops don't get paid...... For now the increasingly weird behaviour of the Emperor (crucifixion of high ranking women,) is damaging the mighty in Rome but until someone decides that the cull of their mates in Rome has gone far enough I guess that observation is a good gambit?

And its because of the above that I believe that military commanders are prepared to get friendly with the barbarians. Because you don't want to be looking both ways at once and a tame barbarian is better than a mad emperor - or so I have been told!

Note also that tribes within and without the Empire are not frightened of the Legions, or of Rome's ability to provide support. Such a perceived weakness means trouble.

So I have a feeling that there will be tensions without and within the provinces growing at the same time as a disaster looms in Rome.

One might argue that a strong military minded Emperor who would justly extend the rule of Rome would be welcome. Just don't look at me, I heard Sen Brutus say it.....

And interestingly Senator Brutus has gone missing. Any ideas what might of happened?

Not sure if other players agree put I am getting the feeling that the great and good in Rome are feeling stuck between the mob who is likely to lynch them if they do not see progress on bread, circuises and a roof over their heads and a Emperor who seems to want to humiliate and cull them and sale the places in the senate for 600,000 denarii a pop.

Instead of players being nasty to Richards favoured NPC's (it was only one well maybe two diets, the Senate in Venice, the Janissary Corp honest!) this game feels like the revenge of the NPC (Nero) on player factions.

So in these circumstances the great and good are rather looking to the Army leaders to do their job and something to distract a) The Mob and b) The Emperor from their problems by beating up barbarians........roughly!

I do not think its too much to ask & if the tribes are not that scared of the Legions............who's fault is that??????? think they might be a bit more scared in some people stopped "observation" and got on with slaughtering Druids & getting our Eagle back etc.

Also think that commanders who are very good at keeping the peace in a region (also known as fence sitting) may find the government in Rome either moving Legions from nice quite area's to Commanders and area's were they can do some good. Or thinking its now stable enough for a new push to extend the frontier.

The later seems to have been the result of commanders in Britain raising a 4th Legion and building bath houses. Since Roman Britain is clearly stable again and garrison up to max strength (generally Britain has 2 to 4 Legions) its clearly time to go on the offensive and win some glory for Rome and the Emperor!

Now all we need to know is what happens in East, on the Rhine and on the Danube!

Personally, I wonder how the first player to get hailed as Emperor by his own troops is going to handle it:suspect:

I think Stuart in particular makes a lot of sense. I for one am trying to Romanise my province whilst staying within the perceived ‘foreign policy’ of the Emperor. This includes pursuing expansion only if sanctioned by the Emperor and Senate. Didn’t Caesar Augustus pretty much say ‘that’s enough now’ except where Parthia and a few others needed slapping down?

Great viewpoint Stuart!

I am waiting on a response to the offer to help recover Eagles. But I’m also aware that the troops may need training and we need to choose our Barbarians wisely.

Note also that I was surprised to find a tribe within the empire, in a province that has no troops stationed there ..... DONT LIKE THE ROMANS!

So my approach is to target some barbarians to give a shoeing to and provide a garrison to address the hearts and minds of the dissatisfied.

However It will be 819 before I move on these unless the god Agema causes chaos in my little back yard.

And of course I need to be too busy, too necessary and just successful enough in the province to be recalled. I will also do enough to have the troops just pu tip with me and NOT proclaim any Kaiser nonsense... to quote Robert Graves.

Interesting.......so basically we have got a lot of Roman Generals trying to balance on top of the fence and be:

a) Successful but not so successful that the Emperor turns against them or their own troops start lifting them up on shields.

b) Run a peaceful province but not so peaceful that Rome starts to strip them of troops for more active parts of the frontier.

c) Give impression that they are working really hard to keep things under control but sadly things are not so stable and secure they are their area can be used as a base for winning the Emperor Glory in a foreign war.

- Augustus after winning a massive civil war and the loss of three legions in Germania may have decided enough was enough for now, but when the Govt of Claudius decided that the Emperor needed to win some popularity and show himself worthy of his military ancestors what happened? A jolly nice boat trip to Kent with x4 Legions. With x5 Legions now in Britannia.......Hiberia and Caladionia should be a nice simple quick win. What could possibly go wrong sailing across the Irish Sea? (just remember to feed the sacred chickens).

It will be interesting to see which of the fence sitting commanders over balances or is pushed off the fence first ?!

Would also add that Scipio, Caesar, Sulla, Pompey etc did not worry about such matters & its just as well that the Gov of Syria is a proper old style Roman.

The question is now the Eastern Legions have taken the field does this take the pressure off? Or increase it on the rest of the Army to try and equal the Glori of the Eastern Legions?

You have it spot on

Rome was the same as today! History was written by the winners and with a full belly and a few snifters in the mess.

My chap is shaving himself a ballane pole - a la high wire.

But I suspect RIB will blow up in our faces.....

Hmm, after a good kip, I think I might usefully add to my comments above with: Scipio, Caesar, Sulla, Pompey did not act without thought and preparation but when they did they acted decisively and with all their available power.

In RIB I see several folk preparing but not ready to act.

Remember if we have the Senate, The Emperor, the Legions and the Locals to "satisfy" we don't want to be facing more than one of them at a time.

Just a thought. I'll keep the balancing pole handy.  

Regor wrote:Hmm, after a good kip, I think I might usefully add to my comments above with: Scipio, Caesar, Sulla, Pompey did not act without thought and preparation but when they did they acted decisively and with all their available power.

In RIB I see several folk preparing but not ready to act.

Remember if we have the Senate, The Emperor, the Legions and the Locals to "satisfy" we don't want to be facing more than one of them at a time.

Just a thought. I'll keep the balancing pole handy.  

Scipio - A commander who volunteered to take over in Spain and face odds of three/four to one after a total disaster had killed his father and uncle and wiped out the two major Roman forces in Spain. Then invaded Africa against huge odds and with his brother planned and conducted the campaign leading to Magnesia. 25,000 Romans & allies V 70,000 Selucids with Armoured Cavalry & Elephants.

Sulla - Marched on Rome with backing of one other officer of Senatorial Rank because he was feeling offended, then marched off to war in East before marching on Rome again.

Ceasar - The ultimate non fence sitter both as a commander and a fence sitter. So heedless of personal safty that he was willing to defy both Pirates and Sulla to their face, the whole of Alexandria with a mere 600 men and invade Greece by Sea when Pompey had total command of the Sea, twice the troops and four times the Cavalry.

Pompey - Great planner and great at logistics and even better at claiming credit for victories which had basically been won by other people. Think of the four commanders he is the commander who most RIB commanders most model themselves on in basically aiming to win the battle before it is even fought. Pity about Pharsalus as up to that point had generally had best of campaign but forced to fight a battle by his allies was totally battered by Ceasar and commanders like Mark Anthony (the Marshal Nay of the Roman Army, rubbish general but inspirational battle captain) then he gets betrayed and murdered by other allies.

Stuart, I cannot disagree: but now you’ve stated is so clearly I’m a little sad that all I have to lookforward to is getting battered, betrayed and murdered (by other allies)....

Actually because I am strategically or tactically no Hero of the ancient world I’m planning on being a good and efficient General if somewhat cautious until I find my feet.

For all my efforts I’m not that well read.

Regor wrote:Stuart, I cannot disagree: but now you’ve stated is so clearly I’m a little sad that all I have to lookforward to is getting battered, betrayed and murdered (by other allies)....

Actually because I am strategically or tactically no Hero of the ancient world I’m planning on being a good and efficient General if somewhat cautious until I find my feet.

For all my efforts I’m not that well read.

I am sure your character is actually a proper Roman Hero of the old school......after all in the picture he has got the horse and the furry cloak.

Ref Rome is Burning - I am starting to wonder if Roman Generals may be in greater danger in Rome than at the head of their Legions?

Also think Agema games often follow the maxim that "the morale is to the physical is as three is to one" and a reputation for extreme violance and holding a grudge is a good way to get others to ignore you and annoy someone else. Sort of noticeable that the only revolt against the authority of Alexander the Great was caused by an account of his death and the next one started as soon as he was officially dead.

Some probably know much more about this than me but the actual size of the Roman Army in the Imperial Period always seems very small for the amount of territory and population it had to cover. Which tends to lead to two thoughts - a) A lot of people thought that they were better off in the Empire than outside.......a nice sane Emperor who is kind to local hopes and ambition is good for this and b) People where too scared of the reputation of the legions to risk it.

Unfortunately hard won and really, really valuable reputation for sane Government and Military Might need's to be protected, such as by getting our lost Eagle and en-slaved subjects back and the takes stuck on a cross, or the nasties are going to get bolder and the locals are going to wonder why they are paying their taxes.

Just a thought.........allowed since my Character is sat in one of the great centre's of Roman Philosophy, and a long, long way from PJ wearing Horse Archers, nasty men in blue or any of this proto Vikings lead by a Viking Queen (that can not be good) and proto Knights of the Round Table not acting all reasonable and friendly. Come off it! Reasonable Sarmatians!! what next "nice town you have here, lot timber and thatch.......Can we interest you in the Sarmatian Fire Insurance Society."

Its a sodding shake down........only worth paying if they promise to take a left and go and go and annoy the Parthian's instead. The Senate expects its Generals to fight, no one said anything about having to fight fair.

= Roman manual of dirty tricks

Stuart, I completely agree. With a popular and sane emperor who has a plan for the enlargement and good management of the Empire and Generals who go out and batter our enemies... Plus governors who can get romanise the blighters we have incorporated.... what could go wrong??

The current issues are that barbarians see Romans as effete and weak. So yes to a bit of soldiering! But I'd like to know that the Emperor has my back and the Senate was supportive.

What will it take for people like us to adjust the status quo (if that's not a non sequitur, and a double negative )?

Back in the day, like now I believe that unless you were made of the right stuff (family, ability and luck) people would and could live their lives quite freely and successfully without worrying too much about politics in Rome.

In Macedonia for example, you could herd sheep and eat olives until you were sick!

When the time is right I look forward to being able to break some barbarian heads over the Rhine or Danube...

Latest RIB is now out............does anyone have a clue about what the hell is going on?

- It would seem that my character has cracked........his sacred chickens are off their food and his nerves are shot away by the strain of trying to project manage even a tiny amount of the required re-building work in Rome from a distance.

- Meanwhile his building foreman/agent in the builders guild may have turned to drink after having his patroness crucified and has been banished from Rome to the Eastern Front. Personally I think like his patroness before him his fall has been set up by slander and lies, but what the hell is a Roman Builder going to find to do in the East. Grand Tour of Greek Temples to study the various building styles perhaps?

But weirdly while everything is basically going wrong my character is now up to No4 on the Prestige List which is worrying.......are things even worse for other Roman players? Or is my faction gaining credit for its continued battle with Roman planners to rebuild bits of Rome while other factions such as the Syrian basically threw 3m denerri into the rebuilding fund and buggered of to pursue the easy life that is a war with Parthia.

Interestingly the Emperor Nero is highest placed Roman on list - might have been even higher if the Twins born to him this month had not been both girls.
While No 1 & No 2 on the Prestige list are the two Barbarians who have been most insulting about Rome.

In that unimportant part of the game not concerned with Roman planning regulations and were the hell are we going to find 89m Denerii for next ten years it would seem the easy option to gain prestige is insult Rome. Easy but not risk free since the Emperor seems to react and apply pressure on Roman Commander's. Meanwhile other Barbarians are looking to be bought off, while the Dacians seem to be playing a game of a) Raid Roman province b) Deny it was anything to do with them and arrest the people who did it c) Then set free everyone who raided Rome.....apart from the leader of the raid. Who is now doubt suffering in a Dacian Cell equiped with silks, beds of soft lambs wool and hot and cold running slave girls.

Well.... I think Nero is mad. Whatever we do in his sight/awareness will be twisted and used against us. I am keeping my head down, doing as little as possible to attract attention and sorting problems that will allow more freedom of action “next year”. There’s a building on small successes to be done.

However when someone less mad decides to take the purple..... I won’t be sad.

Still processing - more will follow

With Nero's lovely twin girls, perhaps this is the ideal time for the brave, brave Sen Pomponious to strongly advise that Nero allows females to be his heirs? In person would be great... (just leave your will with the Vestals first...).

If Regor really thinks Nero is mad, then I challenge him to impeach The Mad Emperor under Article 25 of the Constitution... (err, sorry - another time, another place...).

More seriously, the external threats seem to be a-building. Personally I think Gallus in Syria ("Mars Ultor" to his friends), the Legates along the Rhine and Danube and even Maximus in Britain seem to be making solid preparations to stick a pilum or two into the barbs.

Johntindall wrote:With Nero's lovely twin girls, perhaps this is the ideal time for the brave, brave Sen Pomponious to strongly advise that Nero allows females to be his heirs? In person would be great... (just leave your will with the Vestals first...).

If Regor really thinks Nero is mad, then I challenge him to impeach The Mad Emperor under Article 25 of the Constitution... (err, sorry - another time, another place...).

More seriously, the external threats seem to be a-building. Personally I think Gallus in Syria ("Mars Ultor" to his friends), the Legates along the Rhine and Danube and even Maximus in Britain seem to be making solid preparations to stick a pilum or two into the barbs.

Fairly sure the senate and people of Rome are not going to put aside their ancient laws and go in for Barbarian practices such as a female ruler's. Last person who was suspected of having suc thoughts was Marc Anthony and it did not go well for him.

Legally Roman Women are not considered to be Roman Citizens and with the exception of the vestals were always under the authority of a male family member. This was usually either their father or husband depending on marital status. If a woman was left with no male family members , then she was left with no family members then she was assigned a new guardian, according to the wishes left in her previous guardian's will.

Interestingly, although women were forbidden from voting or holding public office, they could still possess and inherit property. Which in the case of the heirs of the Julio-Claudian family would include the whole of Egypt as a private estate. So I rather suspect that if the Empress becomes a widow we could see a whole load of Roman Generals having talks with their divorce lawyers.

Legally Romans can only divorce their wife for the following reasons:

- Adultery
- Poisoning the husbands children
- Counterfeiting the husbands keys

But plenty of Romans seem to have managed a divorce without any third parties or poisoned kids. Assume key counterfeiting must have been a big problem.

As for the natural borders of the Empire, think it would look a lot more tidy if they were on the Oder, Tigris and the Empire included the whole of the two rather wet and windy isles north west of Gaul. But I am sure our heroic generals already have this in hand.

Okay nice to see in the latest turn the prices for Livestock

Per pony, donkey, pig; 200
denarii.
Per cow, ox; 800 denarii.
Sheep; 300 denarii.

But, What about the GOATS, or are they considered a sacred animal only eligible for sacrifice at the temples?